Despite the tendency towards “argument”, there’s been some great comments left and I hope that Colin benefited from the discussion.

For those interested, the article Mind Reading as Social Commentary presents my response through *performance* of the very topic under discussion here. It’s satirical, it’s fun, you might like it – or hate it…

Oddly (and ironically) enough, this piece *does* benefit from a statement, and it’s *about* statement.

When you say “Sometimes people can guess the idea behind an artwork, but the hit rate is low,” is this a source of personal frustration to you,

Absolutely not.

I get what you are saying about subject matter now. I think what you call conceptual subject matter I would put under meaning (not that the distinction is that important), which is all the stuff you can’t really get from looking at the piece… or as I said in the above comment to Paul, the stuff that is more open to the viewer’s interpretation.

When you say “Sometimes people can guess the idea behind an artwork, but the hit rate is low,” is this a source of personal frustration to you, or just something you have noticed when people look at your work or art in general? Just curious…

My example of the image of the clearcut forest was just an example, not a discussion of an actual image. And I didn’t get into how the viewer might know that the conceptual subject was environmental vs. forest manangement. That could be achieved through an artist staement, background info about the artist, the work in a series of images, etc. My point was to clarify the distinctions Colin was putting forward between superficial and conceptual subject matter.

“It’s hard to know, which is why I think that if art is communication, it’s not very effective at it. The message communicated all too often seems to be determined by the receiving end, which is a weird way for communication to work.”

Yes, a lot is determined by the receiving end, which could be frustrating for many artists who may be surprised by what actually gets communicated and what gets completely lost. That’s what makes art a particularly interesting and tricky form of communication in my mind. If it were straight forward with one known result, it might be science, not art. An artist takes risks by putting something out there for the viewer’s interpretation. Don’t you ever feel like some people “get” your work and some don’t? Have you communicated well with those who get it, who really resonate with it, who want to buy it? Or is it just that they share your interests, taste, etc.?

Well, it might mean that. Or it might mean ‘laminated root rot is a really big problem for forest managers, and often the only sensible management practice when a stand is infected is to clearcut the infected stand and replant with a resistant species.’

It’s hard to know, which is why I think that if art is communication, it’s not very effective at it. The message communicated all too often seems to be determined by the receiving end, which is a weird way for communication to work.

Assuming we are talking about the visual arts here.

Appearance and Subject are things that a viewer can determine – either absolutely, or at least with little doubt.

Have a look at this.

You could tell me what this looks like and what the superficial subject is.

The Idea you couldn’t tell me just by looking at the photo. Or at least I would be very surprised if you could. Sometimes people can guess the idea behind an artwork, but the hit rate is low. Some part of what the idea was in my head when I took the photo is in the comment discussion which you can open.

The Meaning? Well it has no meaning. I only included Meaning, because people do, and this wasn’t the time to get into that discussion.

which is closer to your idea.

Can you give me an idea of superficial vs. conceptual subject?

Do you mean like a painting of a clear cut forest has the superficial subject of landscape whereas the conceptual subject may be that humans are destroying the earth (depending on the particular artist’s intent)? Kind of simplistic, but I am wondering how you differentiate…